Yeah no, I am not buying the same game over again. Sun and Moon came out less than a year ago, I know this is supposed to be like Pokemon Yellow. But honestly give it some time, like wait until late 2018 and put it on the switch so it is worth buying.

Mega Evolutions are such a bad gimmick though, why do you want more of them for any reason besides their pretty designs?

I just want a post game, something that can keep me playing for a while after the main game. Battle Tree is okay I suppose, but I can never get into things like that.

Mystery Dungeon does it good thou, better than the main series. I just kinda want new dungeons to explore I guess, new areas like that where I can catch new pokes. The legendary Tapu things don't count, of coursw

@MegaBoy : Why would they first put the originals on the 3ds, but then put the sequels/remakes on the switch? How would trading between both games work now? They're part of the same generation!

@Musical : Z-moves are also a gimmick, and besides, Mega Evos have MORE than just looks going for them. They get a stat boost, an ability change, and maybe even an extra type.

I know both of those sound like I'm arguing, but I don't want to have to.

@RotomSlashBlast

*cough cough* Pokemon bank for the switch *cough cough*

but they aren't sequels or remakes, they are literally just the same game with a few extra pokemon sprinkled in.

@MegaBoy : Except it's NOT just extra pokemon. Besides, it's a sister game. That's the term I was looking for. Anyway, how can you expect new games from the same generation to introduce Pokemon which aren't even in the programming of the originals? By the way, I'm not just talking about alternate forms, I mean individual, brand-new Pokemon that are only in the data of the ultra games. They never did it before, and never since.

@RotomSlashBlast : I honestly don't care for the new Pokemon, I just don't want the same plot with extra sparkles put in, especially if most of it's Offline/Online features are exactly the same. And the fact that it is on the same console, that's why I buy like six versions of Mega Man 4.

Honestly I have no feelings one way or a another. I'm a enough of a sucker that I probably will buy one of them/ask parents for one of them for Christmas anyways. It looks unique, though I would like to see more details. After all, we only saw less than 2 minutes of footage for it.

And I just reread your previous post, you literally just stated it would add extra pokemon.

I said it WOULDN'T add extra Pokemon, where did it say that?

@RotomSlashBlast : "By the way, I'm not just talking about alternate forms, I mean individual, brand-new Pokemon that are only in the data of the ultra games"

@Rotom : I know, I know, late reply.

Z-Moves are literally just a damage multiplier, thou.
look at this table

Z-Moves aren't affected by STAB either, if I am correct (I, which means at its peak power, a Z-move would only offer a x1.42 damage multiplier (the highest damage multiplier that can be achieved seems to be around the range of 1.95 and 2*). Also note that non-attacking moves generally raise/lower one of the affected poke's stats by 1 stage.

Sure, Z-Moves don't seem very useful now, but think about it this way: any Poke can use them. You can't simply argue that Z-Moves and Mega Evolutions are the same thing, because they are completely different. For example, my Smeargle, Da Vinci, in my Sun playthrough lacked heavily in attack power (it was like level 22, with 26 Attack when I boxed it) but its Z-Move helped it gain an edge. Using Quick Attack, my Smeargle gained a 2.25x power boost, which usually helped he gain an edge until he was able to obtain Water Gun (which lead to why poor Da Vinci got boxed; apparently, my Smeargle had an even more pitiful Special Attack, and didn't even get to benefit from a 1.5x STAB boost from it. rip)

*Theoretically, the highest multiplier can be 100, since all attacking moves with a power between 0 and 65 got their attack power boosted to 100. 100 power by itself isn't relatively strong, so simply mentioning that the multiplier can go above 2 only for that one entry on the table wouln't really portray what I am trying to get across.

---

Man, but those Mega Evolutions though. I can type probably 20k characters worth of text just explaining how much I despise these things for many, many different reasons. For one, they do not help with balancing different Pokes at all. As we all know, there's a solid 50 to 150 different Pokes that actually need a power boost like what Mega Evolutions offer, but they get none; as of now, the only Pokes which recieved the boost they needed from Mega Evolutions were Beedrill, Sableye, Pinsir, and Heracross. The reason why each of these Pokes need this power boost is because:
a.) 3 out of four of these Pokes are Bug-typed, which are notorious for a majority not being made at the full potential at which they can by Game Freak, while the other ones are simply early game bugs.
b.) 3 out of four of these Pokes have the possibility to gain an evolution. Pinsir, Heracross, and Sableye have absolutely no evolutions besides their Basic form. They all could have recieved at least one normal evolution for the 10+ years they have been in these games, but really haven't besides these Mega Evolutions.

Now, these two factors of which Mega Evolutions are desperately leeching upon in order not to look unnecessary can be achieved in other methods. In order to strengthen the Pokes I have mentioned above, Game Freak can simply give these pokes (and others that I may have not mentioned) a BST boost and/or a better moveset, along with giving the ones without an evolution one.

Don't give me the "but wot if Game Freak has no ideas for what Sableye, Heracross, and Pinsir at all?" either. Anyone with at least a drop of creativity would know that a hypothetical Sableye evolution would be more lanky and svelte than its pre-evolution, similar to the fictional creatures they are based upon. Pinsir and Heracross can become either more devilish insect monsters than they already are, or go a similar route as Incineroar and evolve to appear more like the fighters they are based upon. Imagine a four-armed demon Pinsir, with more prominent legs and the ability to actually suplex a Poke and do damage based on the Poke's weight relative to this insect thing.

Now, back onto Mega Evolutions. The reason why they make the entire game less balanced is because, unlike Z-Moves, every Poke that uses it gets a different boost, and not every Poke has the ability to use them either. If Mega Evolutions claim to "balance the game by making weaker Pokes harder, better, faster, and stronger" then why do legendary Pokes need them as well. Sure, at worst, these Legendary Pokes compete less good than other Legendary Pokes (maybe) but you can't say that Mewtwo needs 2 Mega Evolutions because it is such a poor, unprivileged poke and not even mention how Luvdisc has 330 BST and no evolution to its name without looking petty.

Here, I will list a group of Pokemon:
Lucario, Gardevoir, Gallade, Latias, Latios, Rayquaza, Mewtwo, Salamence, Altaria.

These pokes are stronk things. They are all relatively popular Pokes (especially Lucario and Gardevoir ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) )

Nice I hit the character limit. Rant continues in another post

@MegaBoy : Before that, I said, "how can you expect new games from the same generation to introduce Pokemon which aren't even in the programming of the originals?"

@Musical : It's also quite broken when you can just plow through wild Pokemon with Z-moves.

Wow, to think that this went from a discussion about Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon, to an argument.

@RotomSlashBlast : I think they are going to add them in, it's what they did with ORAS. I saw they added the Gen 3 Model during fights, along with new pokemon. Honestly I don't care about the New Pokemon, I just don't want to play the same game over.

@RotomSlashBlast : It's not an argument if I'm actually using mathematical evidence and you reply with one sentence replies; it's just you being too stubborn to accept that you're w rong

Anyway, you can already plow through wild pokemon, with or without Z-Moves and/or Mega Evolutions.

By the time you're at the mid-point in SuMo, your pokes are at least 5-10 levels above wild Pokes; you can just knock them out in a single hit, possibly two if the poke you're using is weak or is attacking a poke that resists their attack.

have you ever played Gen 2 Pokemon?
The wild pokes are underleveled as hecc in that game, so much that you need to spend about an hour to train a freshly caught poke up to speed with the rest of your team when you reach the city with the dragon gym. I bet you'd still say that Z-Moves are "overpowered" just because they can knock out a wild pokemon in one hit, even though you could do that already with a normal attack.

don't get me started on the fact that you can say the same thing about Mega Evolutions. You get a Latios/as in ORAS after Watson with a Mega Stone, and you get a Lucaro with a Mega Stone after beating the rollerskate gal in XY. I dunno, man, but I think getting a Legendary Poke with the ability to Mega Evolve in the early game would be more overpowered than a one-time damage multiplier (which is under 2 most of the time, which is a lower damage multiplier than a super-effective attack).

To be completely honest, I'm pretty sure that you only like Mega Evolutions for the fact that they look pretty and can wipe out that one trainer when your other pokes aren't enough.

EDIT: read this article too you r at it's a Eurogamer article, dunno if that's good

@MegaBoy : Oras didn't include pokemon that weren't in the code of the originals, unless you're referring to Mega Evolutions and Hoopa's Unbound Form. What do you even MEAN by "new pokemon"? Even MARSHADOW was in SuMo's code. If you're talking about Pokemon that already existed that you could catch, in the new game, then that's not new. That's just availability.

@Musical : I meant in the early game. When your lead pokemon takes more than just 1 move to KO a wild Pokemon. Besides, How about that encoutner with the first Nihilego that it doesn't let you catch? Or how about Totem Pokemon? These are some of the key encounters in the game, and Totem Lurantis is one of, if not the ONLY enemy I happened to lose at. These are encounters that test your strength and are super climact-

"Salandit, use Inferno Overdrive."

*1SHOTS TOTEM LURANTIS*

...Huh. Looks like Sunny Day Solar Blades backfired for Lurantis.

Also, by the way, you only get Mega Latios/Latias after NORMAN, not Wattson.

@RotomSlashBlast : what the actual hell are you even talking about. You are just rambling on about something. I'm saying that I don't care for the new Pokemon and then you denied the fact that there were new pokemon, even though you just said there were new Pokemon. I said ORAS had new pokemon in the code. This is just confusing.

@MegaBoy : So can you PLEASE clear up what you MEAN by "new pokemon"? Also, how did I say that there WERE new Pokemon? Also, I don't like it when my words are twisted around.

@RotomSlashBlast : ... I'm done with this, i'm out.